Nostalgia, as I kind of miss the HD format war - Page 2 - High-Def Digest Forums
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  #11  
Old 03-05-2013, 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by fitprod View Post
99% of 7 million accounts WB was touting at CES. The trick for the studios will be how do I sell something that most people feel has no value...
I suspect 99% of those accounts were from people who signed up and haven't touched it since trying it out.

Mobile streaming just doesn't seem like a market that will work well to me. Given the bandwidth requirements, you'll need to be near WiFi to use it (or drain most of your 4G for the month). But that makes it impossible to watch the content in the situations where you're most likely to want to watch something on your mobile device: when you're on the bus/train, sitting in an airport that has no free WiFi (many major ones), sitting on an airplane (streaming services over WiFi are BLOCKED), etc.

That leaves streaming at home. But if you bought the disk, why are you streaming it?
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Old 03-05-2013, 10:49 PM
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That leaves streaming at home. But if you bought the disk, why are you streaming it?
Because it's more convenient.

Remember that most consumers are not like us and for them convenience trumps quality. Besides, streaming 1080p HDX from VUDU doesn't look that bad at all. Not as good as Blu-ray but still much closer to Blu-ray PQ than upscaled DVD. Personally I'll always prefer to get up and put that disc in the tray because it's always worth the extra quality, but the industry cares more about what the majority wants and that majority wants convenience first and quality second. They always have.

Of course the nice thing about new release Blu-ray purchases is that usually you don't have to choose because the UV code comes packed in with the SKU and it is generally HD. Disney is not on board yet but that's no loss for me and I think it's only a matter of time before they release on UV.
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Old 03-06-2013, 08:04 PM
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The only manufacturer that would be dumb enough to attempt a non-unified 4K physical format would be Toshiba at this point, and all the studios would probably kick them to the curb, since they don't want another format war.

fitprod
So one point we're supposed to take away from this post is Sony can learn from its mistakes (at least to some degree) but Toshiba can't?
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:05 PM
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So one point we're supposed to take away from this post is Sony can learn from its mistakes (at least to some degree) but Toshiba can't?
The thing is... Toshiba; and Microsoft, for it's own reasons (steaming and the thought of a VC1 standard for it); were the only manufacturing companies that were not on board with Blu-ray at the launch, even though they had the option to unify the formats the previous fall before all hell broke loose.

Sony has learned over the years about trying to completely go on their own, mainly from the VHS/Beta war. They also saw their multiple attempts to launch new audio formats go up in smoke more than one... Mini-disc and SACD (another failed format war on both sides.)

Toshiba probably has learned from it's mistakes, especially after having to finish paying off whatever contracts were signed with Paramount and Universal for their exclusivity. But I don't even know if Toshiba gives a crap about the CE market anymore. They only have about 13 TV models (2 3D), 1 BD player and 3 DVD player. (For crying out loud one of the DVD players is a VHS combo unit... I know people have VHS but is there really a market for it?)

fitprod
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Old 03-06-2013, 10:13 PM
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"Mistake" is a pretty strong word. So just because you lost means it was a mistake to play? The format war could have gone either way. Even Toshiba thought they they would get Warner down to the last minute. Coin flip, HD DVD lost.

But did Toshiba and Microsoft really lose? DVD still accounts over 70% of revenue and here we are almost completing year seven. And of that 28% share that Blu-ray enjoys, I would guess that at least 2/3 of those sales have a DVD inside. So approximately 90% of all OD sales include a DVD. Toshiba is not hurting.

And what did Sony sacrifice to win the format war? Just their #1 position in the HD console war. A smaller cut in a $10-12 billion a year (US) software gaming industry to get a $2.5 billion a year Blu-ray format that Toshiba earns a lot of royalties anyway. Do you think MS didn't realize the sacrifice and that they would be the beneficiaries?

Every video format that has come along has been through a format war. The only difference is that the winner of this one is nothing more than a niche format, a supplement to DVD. Big deal.

Have you checked out the Walmart racks lately. Some stores are reducing Blu-ray stock and replacing it with DVD. Did somebody say "failure"?
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  #16  
Old 03-06-2013, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by fitprod View Post
The thing is... Toshiba; and Microsoft, for it's own reasons (steaming and the thought of a VC1 standard for it); were the only manufacturing companies that were not on board with Blu-ray at the launch, even though they had the option to unify the formats the previous fall before all hell broke loose.

Sony has learned over the years about trying to completely go on their own, mainly from the VHS/Beta war. They also saw their multiple attempts to launch new audio formats go up in smoke more than one... Mini-disc and SACD (another failed format war on both sides.)

Toshiba probably has learned from it's mistakes, especially after having to finish paying off whatever contracts were signed with Paramount and Universal for their exclusivity. But I don't even know if Toshiba gives a crap about the CE market anymore. They only have about 13 TV models (2 3D), 1 BD player and 3 DVD player. (For crying out loud one of the DVD players is a VHS combo unit... I know people have VHS but is there really a market for it?)

fitprod
You forgot their laptops in the CE realm. I'm typing on one now (Qosmio). Pretty impressive lineup they've garnered.
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  #17  
Old 03-07-2013, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post
You forgot their laptops in the CE realm. I'm typing on one now (Qosmio). Pretty impressive lineup they've garnered.
Well, I sort of mean that, I guess I never really think of computers as CE. I guess I sort of define it as home theater equipment. I should have been a little more specific.
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  #18  
Old 03-07-2013, 01:23 PM
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I understand that perspective. Still, back to the topic somewhat, I also understand Toshiba's reluctance to concede after the cash cow that DVD was for them. Divvying up those profits to a larger consortium of organizations (as in the BDA) was probably something they were trying to avoid (they overestimated the effect of short-term payoffs). Stupid? Maybe. Greedy? Yes, just like many other for profits (Sony being no exception). I can't imagine them repeating it again given the diminishing returns delivered by optical media.
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Old 03-08-2013, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post
I understand that perspective. Still, back to the topic somewhat, I also understand Toshiba's reluctance to concede after the cash cow that DVD was for them. Divvying up those profits to a larger consortium of organizations (as in the BDA) was probably something they were trying to avoid (they overestimated the effect of short-term payoffs). Stupid? Maybe. Greedy? Yes, just like many other for profits (Sony being no exception). I can't imagine them repeating it again given the diminishing returns delivered by optical media.
So, Toshiba may have made a stupid move protecting the royalties from DVD, but Sony is smart trying to take the royalties away? Sony failed to grab the lions share of royalties and Toshiba did not. I don't think Toshiba would sit on their ass and let someone else take the royalties away, there would be a fight and Toshiba would probably win again.
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  #20  
Old 03-08-2013, 01:44 PM
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Sony had a larger consortium, so in this case they were less stupid than Tosh. I'm sure both would look relatively "stupid" based on their corresponding balance sheets showing expenditures versus income related to high-def optical media. No need to give me the third degree on Sony defense...I barely tolerate them as a corporate entity.
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