Panasonic BD30 and Denon BT-2500 confirmed to have weak LFE output w/ HDMI PCM. - High-Def Digest Forums
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Old 01-24-2008, 07:06 AM
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Default Panasonic BD10, BD30 and Denon BT-2500 confirmed to have weak LFE output w/ HDMI PCM.

Just for a little heads up for those looking at new BD players, over at AVS Roger Dressler of Dolby Labs has just confirmed that the Panasonic BD10 and BD30 BD players plus the Denon BT-2500 BD Transport are running 5db quieter than they should be on the LFE channel over HDMI when reproducing PCM. This includes both straight PCM soundtracks and other codecs transcoded to PCM internally; bitstreamed codecs are unaffected. Right now he says that he is "not optimistic" that it can be fixed with firmware, but that it may be possible to raise the HDMI PCM LFE at the expense of the analog LFE - perhaps an advanced menu setting. From my own speculation, its very likely the $2k Denon also has this issue and a real possibility that the BD50 will have it, too.

Let's hope it gets figured out. If you are a Panasonic owner and call tech support to open a case with this issue, it will probably get resolved sooner rather than later (if it can be resolved).

Last edited by Ruined; 01-24-2008 at 07:24 AM.
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Old 01-24-2008, 09:16 AM
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this is obviously dissapointing news, but the good news is that IF you get a 1.3 receiver to pair with the bd-30 you won't have to worry about this problem. That's the best thing to so with this player anyway, so it could be worse imo.
thanks for the info.
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Old 01-24-2008, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
Just for a little heads up for those looking at new BD players, over at AVS Roger Dressler of Dolby Labs has just confirmed that the Panasonic BD10 and BD30 BD players plus the Denon BT-2500 BD Transport are running 5db quieter than they should be on the LFE channel over HDMI when reproducing PCM. This includes both straight PCM soundtracks and other codecs transcoded to PCM internally; bitstreamed codecs are unaffected. Right now he says that he is "not optimistic" that it can be fixed with firmware, but that it may be possible to raise the HDMI PCM LFE at the expense of the analog LFE - perhaps an advanced menu setting. From my own speculation, its very likely the $2k Denon also has this issue and a real possibility that the BD50 will have it, too.

Let's hope it gets figured out. If you are a Panasonic owner and call tech support to open a case with this issue, it will probably get resolved sooner rather than later (if it can be resolved).
For some reason this problem affected other players as well. Aka Samsung BD-1400.
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkadin View Post
this is obviously dissapointing news, but the good news is that IF you get a 1.3 receiver to pair with the bd-30 you won't have to worry about this problem. That's the best thing to so with this player anyway, so it could be worse imo.
thanks for the info.
except for the multitude of titles with PCM tracks instead of DTS-HD MA or TrueHD....I haven't really found an issue myself though...
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkadin View Post
this is obviously dissapointing news, but the good news is that IF you get a 1.3 receiver to pair with the bd-30 you won't have to worry about this problem. That's the best thing to so with this player anyway, so it could be worse imo.
thanks for the info.
I wish that were the case but the problem is there are a ton of Blu-ray discs with PCM soundtracks and no TrueHD/DTS-HDMA. All of those PCM soundtracks will be affected by the design flaw. So you are out of luck even with a 1.3 receiver unless Panasonic fixes it.
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:21 AM
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oh shit.
well....... except for that.
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:24 AM
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couldn't they just do a firmware update that would lower the other levels to compensate?
and then you would just up the volume a little bit to get the normal sound you are used to.
would that work?
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:35 AM
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I always wondered why my PCM lacked oomph...and came across that issue over at AVS. It's really disappointing since it's very noticeable. What's frustrating is the number of titles that contain PCM tracks. When I first got this player I was favoring TrueHD when I had the option between the two and never understood why...now I do. It's disappointing that this could be a flaw in the player that can't be addressed. Especially after spending $500.
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:40 AM
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Bee--I'm a bit confused regarding one point.
can't you up JUST up the lfe using the receiver to compensate for this when listening to the pcm tracks? what am I missing here?
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Old 01-24-2008, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Arkadin View Post
couldn't they just do a firmware update that would lower the other levels to compensate?
and then you would just up the volume a little bit to get the normal sound you are used to.
would that work?
The main problem is that the HDMI and Analog 5.1 outputs are hardwired in parallel on the BD30. Therefore any changes in volume Panasonic to the HDMI LFE will also affect the Analog 5.1 LFE (which does not have the bug). Therefore if Panasonic simply raises the HDMI LFE by +5db to make levels correct, then the Analog 5.1 LFE will be running +5db too hot. There is no obvious way in hardware to get both to work properly at the same time according to Dressler. In other words, the only options would be HDMI LFE -5db, Analog 5.1 LFE Reference; or HDMI LFE Reference, Analog 5.1 LFE +5 db.

Therefore the most likely way Panny/Denon will have to fix this is having some advanced menu option buried somewhere that allows the user to either select correct LFE output for HDMI or correct LFE output for Analog 5.1. Assuming they can do that, that is - those that have seen the inner workings of the BD30 through Panasonic contacts seem very pessimistic about this issue and have even suggested returning the player.
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