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  #1  
Old 11-06-2009, 04:34 PM
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Default players not yet ready to offer backups for Blu-ray discs

Players not yet ready to offer backups for Blu-ray discs

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NOV. 6 | DIGITAL: Come December, studios and anyone else releasing movies on Blu-ray Disc will be required to offer consumers a backup copy of every Blu-ray disc they buy.

But, because no Blu-ray players in the market yet have the capability to make the backups, it’ll be meaningless for consumers in the immediate future.So, the group that administers the provision is delaying some requirements for studios until the second quarter of next year.

The long-planned managed copy requirement goes into effect Dec. 4, as part of the final licensing agreement for AACS, the copy protection used on Blu-ray discs. The final agreement was approved in June by the Advanced Access Content System License Administrator, a consortium of studios, hardware manufacturers and technology companies that licenses the AACS copy protection used on BD. Up to now, studios and Blu-ray companies have been operating under an interim agreement.

Studios and other Blu-ray licensees must sign the final agreement to keep using Blu-ray. So far, 600 companies worldwide have done so, AACS-LA chair Michael Ayers said. Once content holders sign, they must make all discs ready for managed copy, essentially including a link on the disc directing the Blu-ray player to an authentication server.

The way managed copy is expected to work is that a consumer would insert their disc in a Blu-ray player or drive and the disc’s menu would include an option to make a managed copy or the consumer might have to press some buttons on their Blu-ray device to make a copy. Once they choose the option to make a copy, the Blu-ray player connects online to an authorization server, run by a studio, supplier or the AACS-LA. Discs are serialized, and the authentication server will determine if a copy is allowed.

However, until Blu-ray player manufacturers begin offering players with the ability to make full-resolution back-up copies, the managed copy addition on discs will be unnoticeable to consumers.

Manufacturers aren’t ever required to make players that offer managed copy, and so far, no manufacturer has announced plans to do so. However, backers say they expect some devices in the next year, with PC drives likely to be the first products to support managed copy.

In the meantime, that means Blu-ray discs will come out managed copy-ready without any player support.

That’s why the AACS-LA has pushed back the start date for some managed copy requirements from the first quarter to the second. Studios and content holders aren’t required to promote and label discs as managed copy-ready until March 31. That’s when the AACS-LA expects to have its authentication servers up and running, Ayers said.

Ayers said he hasn’t yet heard of any manufacturers announcing plans to include managed copy support, and AACS-LA is trying to make sure that studios aren’t required to promote managed copy before managed copy-capable devices are on the market.

Once devices are out, Blu-ray owners who have purchased discs made after Dec. 4 will already have managed copy-ready movies.

The hope, Ayers said, is once devices are in the market and studios start promoting it, consumers will have a “ready-made library of movies to take advantage of managed copy.”

Studios will be able to charge for those backups and offer more than one copy. They also may choose to offer managed copy rather than a digital copy, which is more expensive to add to a disc.

Managed copies can be burned to recordable Blu-ray or DVD discs, as a download to a Windows Media DRM-compatible portable player or hard drive, on a memory stick, SD card or as a bound copy, such as a digital copy file on the disc, though AACS-LA can approve other methods going forward.

It is possible that Walt Disney Studio’s Keychest and whatever format the Digital Entertainment Content Ecosystem chooses as its standard could be approved as managed copy backups, Ayers said. Neither Disney nor the DECE has approached AACS-LA about that, though the group “would be interested in them taking part,” he said.
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  #2  
Old 11-06-2009, 04:40 PM
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Sounds simple enough.

Unbelievable.
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Old 11-06-2009, 04:50 PM
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Originally Posted by nextoo View Post
Sounds simple enough.

Unbelievable.
Simple as mud.

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That’s why the AACS-LA has pushed back the start date for some managed copy requirements from the first quarter to the second. Studios and content holders aren’t required to promote and label discs as managed copy-ready until March 31. That’s when the AACS-LA expects to have its authentication servers up and running, Ayers said.
Buying a BD disc going to be pot luck - you may get a managed copy disc; you may not. Can't tell by looking until March 31st.
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Old 11-06-2009, 04:59 PM
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I honestly wonder how many people will really care. I mean, you own a copy already on a disc that has a scratch-proof coating. I have yet to own a single Blu-Ray movie that will not play on my BD players because it was damaged. This seems like another case of making a mountain out of a molehill for doom and gloomers like Mike. We heard the exact same rumblings about lack of 2.0 players and movies released with BD Live. And, IMHO, that was definitely much ado about nothing.

And I would be shocked if the PS3 does not support managed copy at some point in time if consumers demand it.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by ack_bak View Post
I honestly wonder how many people will really care.
Well, I care.

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Managed copies can be burned to recordable Blu-ray or DVD discs, as a download to a Windows Media DRM-compatible portable player or hard drive, on a memory stick, SD card or as a bound copy, such as a digital copy file on the disc, though AACS-LA can approve other methods going forward.
This is the future. Just because you own 200 discs that won't work with this, it is not my fault.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post
Well, I care.
You do know that there is software out there right now that you can use to rip your Blu-Ray discs to a hard drive, right? And that many Blu-Ray discs come with a digital copy?
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by ack_bak View Post
You do know that there is software out there right now that you can use to rip your Blu-Ray discs to a hard drive, right?
You been ripping all 200 blu-rays, ack_bak, or are you advocating your method over the studio approved method?
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post
You been ripping all 200 blu-rays, ack_bak?
Nope. Never felt the need to rip my Blu-Ray discs. Waste of hard drive space. I don't watch them on my iPod/iPhone/computer (been there, done that). Judging by the popularity of movie downloads via iTunes not many people are doing this either.


For my kids, many BD's now have a DVD or digital copy, and we have tons of kids movies on DVD anyway. For me, it is painful watching a 90 minute to 3 hour movie on a tiny screen. I typically watch them on my 100" screen. You tend to get used to that after awhile.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by ack_bak View Post
I honestly wonder how many people will really care. I mean, you own a copy already on a disc that has a scratch-proof coating. I have yet to own a single Blu-Ray movie that will not play on my BD players because it was damaged. This seems like another case of making a mountain out of a molehill for doom and gloomers like Mike. We heard the exact same rumblings about lack of 2.0 players and movies released with BD Live. And, IMHO, that was definitely much ado about nothing.

And I would be shocked if the PS3 does not support managed copy at some point in time if consumers demand it.
As many as there are who want managed copy on DVD.

Why people are excited at the thought of studios taking more and more of your disc owning rights away is beyond me.
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  #10  
Old 11-06-2009, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post
This is the future. Just because you own 200 discs that won't work with this, it is not my fault.
When are you going to start the thread complaining how DVDs don't have managed copy, and you can't do this with them?

I'm guessing...never. Explain what the point of your post is...is to to commend Blu-ray on implementing this feature? I'm guessing it's not, but you're failing at the doom and gloom in this post. The logic behind the "this sucks because it wasn't there from the beginning" is not strong. I for one, approve of Blu-ray adding nice features like this. You on the other hand...won't even be able to explain why this is a bad thing. Yeah, my 200 other Blu-rays won't have managed copy. Neither will my 400 other DVDs. How dare the technology improve and offer me more features. I do not prescribe to the rather idiotic notion that putting something new on future products is a bad thing, because prior products didn't have it. Especially on something like this, where most people won't even use it.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:48 PM
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I'm guessing that his point is that existing players are substandard and obsolete because they do not have this feature and that existing software is also obsolete as they do not have this feature.

Which kinda ignores the fact that when implemented it will be a free value added feature of the Blu-ray format that no other method of home viewing has and that new hardware and software that implements this free or low cost feature is fully compatible with existing movies and hardware. Kinda like how Blu-ray 3D will be implemented.

Just seems like another pure FUD post to spread doubt on current Blu-ray offerings.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:57 PM
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I dont even remember what the point of this was anymore lol... I don't like the fact that they are going to charge you for this!! An added value approach would be to offer life time replacement discs. If a disc ever becomes unplayable on two different players send it in and get a free new replacement disc.

I do like the idea if it was able to be copied off the disc on to a Windows Media Center video library, that is interesting....
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  #13  
Old 11-06-2009, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post
Well, I care. This is the future. Just because you own 200 discs that won't work with this, it is not my fault.
Why do you care? This affects your collection of how many Blu-ray discs?

And, well, damn, I was just going to say it is your fault, mike.

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Old 11-06-2009, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mikemorel View Post
Well, I care.

This is the future. Just because you own 200 discs that won't work with this, it is not my fault.
And for the record, are you saying that once CE's release players that support managed copy and content is available that supports managed copy (which will be everything after March 2010 it sounds like) you are all in? Your going to buy Blu-Ray discs and also pay to get the managed copy version?

Just want to know where the goal posts are currently placed on the field.
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Old 11-06-2009, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by ack_bak View Post
And for the record, are you saying that once CE's release players that support managed copy and content is available that supports managed copy (which will be everything after March 2010 it sounds like) you are all in? Your going to buy Blu-Ray discs and also pay to get the managed copy version?

Just want to know where the goal posts are currently placed on the field.
I'm not so much concerned where on the field they are placed but that it is getting to look more and more like the two ends are spread over different fields.

Last edited by bluskiessmingatme : 11-06-2009 at 06:29 PM.
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