HD DVD's Secret Plans...REVEALED

[Xyz123]

No one knows how much Warner & Paramount is making off of HD DVD. One thing I do know is they will be making even more money now & I don't know a studio in the world that wouldn't be happy making more money.

I do like the fact that you said a "high-ranking" executive consultant. I'm not sure where the "high-ranking" came from.

However the consultant said that not a Paramount executive. Consultants can say what they want but it doesn't mean studio executives feel the same way.

Why would you think Warner & Parmount wouldn't be happy making money off of both sides & if the lower selling side starts selling more discs which means even more money for them they wouldn't be happy?

P.S. Just because you didn't like the 2nd & 3rd Matrix doesn't mean everybody didn't. You'll see alot of these boxsets sold especially with the 5 start video & audio rating just like you will when they are finally released on Blu-ray. The boxset was a huge seller for standard DVD. They will be great reference material to show off hidef movies since Warner took the time to go back & remaster all 3 films.

Believe me, an executive consultant speaking publicly on the exact issue he is paid to consult is not speaking against the direct interests/views of his client (he wouldn't be a paid executive consultant for long for anyone). We all know this. Studios prefer a single format (though I admit Universal and Paramount have been quiet on this issue).

How much does it cost Paramount and Warner to support both formats? How much are they making on each disc and how much does it cost to go through a production run? Are they making money yet? And if so, how much per title. My point is that I really don't think the studios are making any money (relative of course) on HD just yet. When the numbers get bigger, we probably will have a different story.


With reference to the Matrix, it is very expensive: $70 on Amazon for the complete, $84 for the Ultimate. If people are complaining about the high price of players, this is quite an investment for a box set, especially when most consumers didn't like the 2nd and 3rd installments all that much. I recognize many early adopters don't really care about price, but my guess is a lot of people do. It will only cost exactly $0 to rent from netflix (if you have subscription of course), and if you only really liked the 1st movie, why not wait until it's available to sell on its own? Besides, how many times can you watch a movie anyway? 5, 10, 20? I imagine most consumers have already seen it several times.

I will not buy the box set when it becomes available on blu-ray. I'll rent it and wait for the first one to become available without the extra expense of the 2nd or 3rd. But if you are a fan of all the movies and want it, more power to you.

[Xyz123]

You may find it easier than you might imagine to get all the true (hype-free) news insight into this fact by reading Video Business Online or by visiting the excellent website they run called Content Agenda www.contentagenda.com ... it has been reported there and elsewhere (Home Media Online) that Warner is by far making the most money in sales of Hi-Def disks. Although I must agree that Warner, and to a lesser extent Paramount, are indeed the smartest studios from a fiscal standpoint by being Neutral, a part of me keeps agonizing over what likely would have been a decisively easier victory for HD-DVD (and therefore the quicker adoption of 1 format in HD Disks) had Warner and Paramount both remained exclusively in HD-DVD camp as they initially were.

The stubborn stupidity of both Disney, Lionsgate and Fox (and of course at the same time Universal) to remain exclusive to one format is truly astounding and the Shareholders of these Companies are amazingly uniformed of how much more income they ought to realize by insisting their companies make the fiscally sound decision of supporting both formats.
DJD

I could analyze what you say in greater detail, but the overt bias is so dramatic, any and all valid points you might make are completely lost.

[messin18]

That's a very insightful commentary.

lol what thread did you read?

[ack_bak]

I bet Warner & Paramount are loving this since they're raking it in off of both sides. The more players out there the more money they will make.

And I agree with the going neutral comment. I love high def freedom & not having to worry about which format a movie is going to be released on in high def.

According to a post made by Amir recently, he claimed that no studio is making money right now when you add in all the associated startup costs. The fact that both Warner and Paramont have to support two niche formats really makes me wonder how much it really pays to be neutral...

[VC-1]

How much does it cost Paramount and Warner to support both formats?

Warner is no doubt making profit from HDDVD, you don't have to go thru the expensive/exclusive pressing process like you do with bluray (only 3 plants making discs).

[djdsaint]

I might analyze what you say in greater detail, but the overt bias is so dramatic, any and all valid points you might make are completely lost.

Bias? So you have absolutely no position? If you have any position that would be your bias. So please consider the use of the word bias more carefully before posting next time.

To set the record straight, I do prefer HD-DVD as you seem to prefer Blu Ray and there is nothing sinister in either of our proclivities is there?

However, when this whole thing launched, I studied this whole scenario VERY carefully and extensively for over 3 months and only in early December of last year finally took the plunge and bought a Toshiba X-A1 on Ebay for $350US. I have never regretted my purchase. However I do not per se dislike Blu Ray as a format and, although I admit I cannot tolerate Sony and their tactics (which I liken to the neo-Cons in their methods of running the US Government), I would still have been open to buying a BR player from another manufacturer. But doing so when Blu Ray is not even close to being finalized as a format would be folly. IF, and I consider it a very big IF, Blu Ray were to emerge victorious in 2 or 3 years and SD DVD started to fade, I would of course buy a BR player (NOT from Sony though) as I am first and foremost a Movie Lover and won't let my disdain for a company like Sony ruin my pursuit of enjoyment of Movie Watching at home in my fine Home Theatre. At this time I am quite satisfied buying the occasional BR exclusive title on standard DVD as it looks very good (clearly superior to what it looked like before I started using the upconversion on my Toshiba HD-XA1) when upscaled. I'll admit that once Fox releases my favourite movies like X-Men 2 and A Fish Called Wanda I'll be angry that I cannot parttake of them in a higher Def format until a winner is declared. I am lucky that my Top 100 movies don't often coincide with the Top 100 Grossing films of all time except with respect to Titanic which I loved and bought two versions of on SD DVD.

So do I have a bias? Of course I do but then show me someone without a bias and I'll show you a non-thinking person.
DJD

[Xyz123]

Bias? So you have absolutely no position? If you have any position that would be your bias. So please consider the use of the word bias more carefully before posting next time.

To set the record straight, I do prefer HD-DVD as you seem to prefer Blu Ray and there is nothing sinister in either of our proclivities is there?

However, when this whole thing launched, I studied this whole scenario VERY carefully and extensively for over 3 months and only in early December of last year finally took the plunge and bought a Toshiba X-A1 on Ebay for $350US. I have never regretted my purchase. However I do not per se dislike Blu Ray as a format and, although I admit I cannot tolerate Sony and their tactics (which I liken to the neo-Cons in their methods of running the US Government), I would still have been open to buying a BR player from another manufacturer. But doing so when Blu Ray is not even close to being finalized as a format would be folly. IF, and I consider it a very big IF, Blu Ray were to emerge victorious in 2 or 3 years and SD DVD started to fade, I would of course buy a BR player (NOT from Sony though) as I am first and foremost a Movie Lover and won't let my disdain for a company like Sony ruin my pursuit of enjoyment of Movie Watching at home in my fine Home Theatre. At this time I am quite satisfied buying the occasional BR exclusive title on standard DVD as it looks very good (clearly superior to what it looked like before I started using the upconversion on my Toshiba HD-XA1) when upscaled. I'll admit that once Fox releases my favourite movies like X-Men 2 and A Fish Called Wanda I'll be angry that I cannot parttake of them in a higher Def format until a winner is declared. I am lucky that my Top 100 movies don't often coincide with the Top 100 Grossing films of all time except with respect to Titanic which I loved and bought two versions of on SD DVD.

So do I have a bias? Of course I do but then show me someone without a bias and I'll show you a non-thinking person.
DJD

12 posts in and you are giving me the advice to "please consider the use of the word bias more carefully before posting next time." That's rich.

What followed; however, was more interesting than your initial posts. There are many here that would enjoy a thoughtful debate on any and all issues concerning this war as long as you are making legitimate arguments and not spewing pure propoganda.

For example, the concept of blu-ray not being a finalized format is an issue hotly contested in the forum. Some focus on the lack of PIP (the ability to not only listen to a director while re-watching a movie, but to be able to watch him and listen to him at the same time you are re-watching a movie) as a major detriment to blu-ray. Most blu-ray supporters laugh at the idea because at least with blu-ray you are actually able to watch movies from Disney, Fox, Sony, MGM and Lionsgate (in addition to Warner and Paramount) even if you can't use this undeniably super-awesome, second-to-none, spectacular feature Hd dvd already has. The point is there are legitimate arguments on both side of the format war, some stronger than others, and you are more likely to get a give and take (I tick off/annoy others myself often enough) if your posts aren't cloaked so much in bias that the underlying arguments are easily overlooked.

[Blu Bear]

A bit off topic but you guys are talking about studio profits on each sale so i put this up. Instead of making a new thread.

What does increased production do for prices of Blu ray discs? Interesting article. Note the increased demand by business customers.

p.s cannot put up link due to status, just google blu ray news

Because of increasing strength in the format, Sony DADC is ramping up its Blu-ray production capabilities and expects to achieve an annual capacity of more than 30 million discs by this fall.

In unit sales, the Blu-ray format, including both 25GB and 50GB discs, has sold about 1 million units in the U.S. through April.

“Due to the high demand for the 50GB Blu-ray product, we will continue to add lines and capacity throughout the year,” said Michael Mitchell, executive VP and general manager at Sony DADC.

Jim Twiggs, Sony DADC VP of strategic development, added, “We are experiencing ever-increasing interest in BD50 product from all genres, markets and studios, both large and small. We have seen title planning requests that include multiple BD50 discs in one package.”

[dobyblue]

Just wait when PS3 owners actually have games to buy, instead of having no games to buy and buying br movies instead.

Games are more expensive - you don't buy heaps of them anyway.

I have F1 2006 Championship Edition and could play that until the next WipEout comes out with no complaints, it's freaking brilliant.

[dobyblue]

Warner is no doubt making profit from HDDVD, you don't have to go thru the expensive/exclusive pressing process like you do with bluray (only 3 plants making discs).

Yeah, the HD 30 disc and the BD25 disc that Warner predominantly uses are almost the exact same price, so what is it you're talking about that's so much more expensive for Warner to release on Blu-ray.

Whatever it is I'm sure they make up for it with the higher sales on Blu-ray as evidenced by their biggest day and date releases like The Departed.

[Philnerd]

Believe me, an executive consultant speaking publicly on the exact issue he is paid to consult is not speaking against the direct interests/views of his client (he wouldn't be a paid executive consultant for long for anyone). We all know this.
<snip>

Why is it that when people quote the Paramount consultant to talk up BD they consistently forget to mention that the Paramount consultant expected an equal number of installed players (1.3 mil each, I believe) for each format at year's end. That's certainly a more realistic estimate than Toshiba (2.5 mil) or the BD camp (8 mil according to Disney), and they seem quite happy to cater to all projected 2.6 million customers regardless of format.

[marine92104]

Why is it that when people quote the Paramount consultant to talk up BD they consistently forget to mention that the Paramount consultant expected an equal number of installed players (1.3 mil each, I believe) for each format at year's end. That's certainly a more realistic estimate than Toshiba (2.5 mil) or the BD camp (8 mil according to Disney), and they seem quite happy to cater to all projected 2.6 million customers regardless of format.

I don't have faith in consultants when it comes to quoting. They could hire a certain number of consultants & each one gives different forecasts but one of them decides to talk to the press. No one can guess the future or what each side will do when it comes to the format war.

Also alot of people will pick & choose numbers from a quote to support their arguement but leave out portions that go against what they believe. I don't agree with that either.

[Xyz123]

Why is it that when people quote the Paramount consultant to talk up BD they consistently forget to mention that the Paramount consultant expected an equal number of installed players (1.3 mil each, I believe) for each format at year's end. That's certainly a more realistic estimate than Toshiba (2.5 mil) or the BD camp (8 mil according to Disney), and they seem quite happy to cater to all projected 2.6 million customers regardless of format.

Yes, he did state this also, but I was referring directly to the idea that studios would prefer one format. I didn't say he stated blu-ray would be the winner this year, only that studios want one format to ultimately win (he also went into detail why and explained why the gaming market isn't a legitimate comparison for co-existence).

[Sonyscrewsall]

Just go neutral and enjoy all your favorite movies in high def...

How about the studios go neutral instead of me or give me a finalized Blu-ray player for $399.

[HomeTheatreFreak]

We've all said from the blu-ray side that Toshiba's only real weapons are cheaper prices (and this is only because they are willing to undercut blu-ray not because of cheaper manufacturing costs) and Universal exclusivity (greatly outweighted by Fox, Lionsgate, MGM, Sony and Disney exclusivity for blu-ray).

These price cuts are exactly what was expected (but maybe at a faster rate) by everyone involved in this war, from Toshiba to Sony to Panasonic to Samsung to Disney to Universal to Warner and so forth.

In fact, Toshiba's plan (and only plan) from the moment Warner and Paramount switched to neutral was to offer lower prices and hope for greater consumer adoption for the format which would force blu-ray studios to switch to neutral instead of only supporting the format they already chose as the successor to dvd.

You hit on an important point though. Who on the blu-ray side is willing to compete on price with Toshiba if it becomes necessary? Sony is the most logical choice, but they are just as interested in pushing the PS3 and cheap standalones won't help sell their next-generation game/media console (and we all know they like to sell their products for a premium anyway).

If blu-ray manufacturers never compete on price and the average consumers starts to care less about studio support, hd dvd could certainly survive until dual-formats become standard.


IN regard to the Matrix trilogy: what a frickin' ripoff. My suggestion is to rent the movies from Netflix for free and buy the 1st installment when it is available by itself. Why pay so much for HD movies you've already seen several times, especially when the 2nd and 3rd movie weren't so good anyway? The price is way too much for the value. JMO.

First of all you should stop making the assumption that just because you dislike a film that other people dislike it as well. Ifor one loved the entire Matrix trilogy and Iknow alot of people that also liked it. To call the Matrix trilogy a rip off is one of the most confusing statments I have ever heard especially coming froma forum for home theatre enthusiasts. The Matrix Trilogy is the single most inclusive release ever for SD DVD and soon to be HD as well. There hasnt been another title released that had as much material packaged in with it. It was 10 discs for 3 movies in SD. To call this a rip off is utterly mind boggling to me.

Bottom line is this, The entire planet loved the Matrix and while alot of people disliked the 2nd and 3rd there are still a boatload of people out there that loved it, me included. To say that buying this set on HD is a rip off or a waste is simply a comment that I not only utterly disagree with but a comment that I cant understand and cant even begin to rationalize with.