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  1. #1501
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedRedSuit View Post
    Oh, here's a post where cuco says he wouldn't "have a leg to stand on" if "someone" just said X. I then point out that I had said X multiple times. He ignored this one too.

    Virtual Reality and Augmented Reality

    ---

    For convenience, copy-paste:

    ---



    "Nothing"?



    ---

    Also:



    ---

    Here you asked me whether I'd probably shun Waggle VR games. My response:



    I also wrote:



    ---

    So there you go. Plenty of evidence of me stating that I am imagining some nice possibilities with regular controller games and specifically not motion. So, you have no leg to stand on, remember? Your words.
    Trying so desperately hard...

    Lets not play stupid here homey. You in no way in hell meant motion controls and waggle by
    Basically any game where the gamepad is reasonably similar to how one would control the thing in reality.
    This was all about a flight stick for flight games and a racing wheel with racers. Which I agreed with, and even reminded yall about how shitty kinect air driving controls was in forza and how vr with a wheel in a racer makes sense as it does for a flight sim. You didnt shun waggle until much later, after all the talk was about normal controllers and flight sticks. But i guess that mountain of evidence i posted is kind of hard to keep neglecting hence why the diversions, hence why the repeated personal attacks, and hence why the new fabricated angles. A few weeks of charades and craziness, coulda been so much easier if you and others were right out in the open right from the get go saying something like f that waggle nonsense, what i want with vr is this not that, but instead... same ol

    Grasping at straws because you are desperate

    Lets wait till e3 shall we? And note i am not surprised one bit that no one is up for the self bet i proposed
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  2. #1502
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    Cuco: you (and others) flip flopped on imagining the possibilities over psvr dude. In less than 2 weeks, I quoted it already...
    RRS: ummmm, regardless if i was or was not imagining the possibilities :deflects to another angle entirely:

    Cuco: you want me to own up to a deflection of a deflection?
    RRS: i dont care what you call it :continues with diversions:


    Mich only said waggle sucks now AFTER that light was shined that psvr and motion resulted in no word from folks who were so vocally anti motion for years. Just as we saw 6 yrs prior as I reminded folks here when cd and others called that same lack of talk out when sony announced move. If yall wanna keep divertin discussions, and fabricate new angles, by all means you are at liberty to do so. But shit makes more sense now that I really understand this crony tactic happens often. lulz
    Lies, I've been saying move sucks all along. WI was the only person to ever speak positive of move and he took a massive beating for it.
    You find anyone that flip-flopped yet?
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  3. #1503
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    Cuco: you (and others) flip flopped on imagining the possibilities over psvr dude. In less than 2 weeks, I quoted it already...
    RRS: ummmm, regardless if i was or was not imagining the possibilities :deflects to another angle entirely:
    No. I specifically defended against this accusation for myself, and for mich, and for Badger.

    For me: GIVEN THAT I IMAGINED THE POSSIBILITIES OF NATAL (proof provided), I CANNOT POSSIBLY FLIP-FLOP TO IMAGINING THE POSSIBILITIES WITH VR. Period. It isn't possible.

    For Badger: He has written of ALL OF VR (with or without Move or waggle of any kind!), therefore HE CANNOT POSSIBLY FLIP-FLOP TO NOT ATTACKING WAGGLE VR ENOUGH. Dismissing all of VR = IMPOSSIBLE TO NOT ATTACK SOME SUB-PART OF IT (like waggel VR) ENOUGH.

    For Mich: Exactly the same as for Badger.

    Mich only said waggle sucks now AFTER that light was shined that psvr and motion resulted in no word from folks who were so vocally anti motion for years.
    1. It doesn't really matter when he said it. Waggle sucks = waggle sucks. Everyone knows mich things waggle sucks.
    2. More importantly, IT DOESN'T MATTER IF HE SAID WAGGLE SUCKS RECENTLY AT ALL -- SINCE HE HAS WRITTEN OFF ALL OF THE ENTIRE VR FEATURE before any of these accusations.

    If yall wanna keep divertin discussions, and fabricate new angles, by all means you are at liberty to do so.
    Holy shit, cuco. No one is "divertin." These simple basic points have stood for tens and tens of pages now:

    (1) That I "imagined possibilities of Natal" (therefore cannot possibly flip-flop TO imagining the possibilities of VR) was posted far before any of your recent nonsense, and far before you replied to it in any capacity (you completely ignored it).

    (2) mich and Badger have both written off all of VR as a gimmick, therefore cannot possibly be somehow "not attacking so-called waggle VR enough" -- they attack it by writing off the ENTIRE FEATURE CONTAINING IT. This was posted far before any of your recent nonsense, and far before you replied to it in any capacity (you completely ignored it).

    I made this point very long ago and repeatedly. So any attempt to call this a diversion is patently ridiculous. It isn't new. It's been made like 15 times by now... you just always ignore it or spin some nonsense in response.
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  4. #1504
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    Quote Originally Posted by michealo View Post
    Lies, I've been saying move sucks all along. WI was the only person to ever speak positive of move and he took a massive beating for it.
    You find anyone that flip-flopped yet?
    You been saying move sucks all along? Thats strange.... these last 2 yrs that sony kept showing off psvr off at every trade show, yeah about that... not a word. Funny definitjon ya got for 'saying it all along'

    I found you to flip flop on imagining the possibilities. Quoted you even (twice by accident!)
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  5. #1505
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    You been saying move sucks all along? Thats strange.... these last 2 yrs that sony kept showing off psvr off at every trade show, yeah about that... not a word. Funny definitjon ya got for 'saying it all along'

    I found you to flip flop on imagining the possibilities. Quoted you even (twice by accident!)
    Yes, I have always been critical of move and waggle. Don't play dumb, please.
    You never found me flip-flopping, I've found lots of yours however....

    Who flip-flopped on waggle?
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  6. #1506
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    Trying so desperately hard...

    Lets not play stupid here homey. You in no way in hell meant motion controls and waggle by
    What? You're making no sense. This obviously means any game where I can still use the gamepad, and it makes sense.

    You said you'd have no leg to stand on if someone were interested only in controller-based VR games and not waggle.

    - I specifically pointed out THAT IS WHAT I AM INTERESTED IN (controller-based VR games; NOT necessarily just cockpit; I "imagined" that FPS might be cool too).
    - I specifically pointed out THAT I WOULD IGNORE MOTION-BASED GAMES FOR VR.

    Both points are quoted very plainly in the post to which you replied. Therefore by your own admission you have no leg to stand on.

    Lets wait till e3 shall we?
    What is that supposed to mean? Suppose your dream comes true, and PS VR turns out to be 95% about Move-related games. OK... so, JUST LIKE I SAID, I will ignore those games. What does that prove? That I've been consistent, and that your accusation was full of shit? OK.

    I didn't "shun motion" until "much later"? No, I shunned it after nearly all motion games turned out to be Oprah shit, once Kinect and Move came out. I don't have to yell out "waggle sucks!" in every post in order for this view to be clear.

    Besides, given that I imagine the possibilities with Natal anyway, it doesn't matter -- half of your flip-flop accusation is not true.
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  7. #1507
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedRedSuit View Post
    No. I specifically defended against this accusation for myself, and for mich, and for Badger.

    For me: GIVEN THAT I IMAGINED THE POSSIBILITIES OF NATAL (proof provided), I CANNOT POSSIBLY FLIP-FLOP TO IMAGINING THE POSSIBILITIES WITH VR. Period. It isn't possible.

    For Badger: He has written of ALL OF VR (with or without Move or waggle of any kind!), therefore HE CANNOT POSSIBLY FLIP-FLOP TO NOT ATTACKING WAGGLE VR ENOUGH. Dismissing all of VR = IMPOSSIBLE TO NOT ATTACK SOME SUB-PART OF IT (like waggel VR) ENOUGH.

    For Mich: Exactly the same as for Badger.



    1. It doesn't really matter when he said it. Waggle sucks = waggle sucks. Everyone knows mich things waggle sucks.
    2. More importantly, IT DOESN'T MATTER IF HE SAID WAGGLE SUCKS RECENTLY AT ALL -- SINCE HE HAS WRITTEN OFF ALL OF THE ENTIRE VR FEATURE before any of these accusations.



    Holy shit, cuco. No one is "divertin." These simple basic points have stood for tens and tens of pages now:

    (1) That I "imagined possibilities of Natal" (therefore cannot possibly flip-flop TO imagining the possibilities of VR) was posted far before any of your recent nonsense, and far before you replied to it in any capacity (you completely ignored it).

    (2) mich and Badger have both written off all of VR as a gimmick, therefore cannot possibly be somehow "not attacking so-called waggle VR enough" -- they attack it by writing off the ENTIRE FEATURE CONTAINING IT. This was posted far before any of your recent nonsense, and far before you replied to it in any capacity (you completely ignored it).

    I made this point very long ago and repeatedly. So any attempt to call this a diversion is patently ridiculous. It isn't new. It's been made like 15 times by now... you just always ignore it or spin some nonsense in response.
    Dat spin!

    It doesnt matter when it was said? The fuck you talkin about dude? That matters more than you think! Lmao
    You guys been hammerin away like mad dodging and weaving like mad ever since I dropped that hammer about vr abd motion. You dont do all that defense, all that smackdown jollies, all those fabricating angles to say it weeks later that waggle sucks and that somehow that somehow that is what it was all this time.
    Man you guys are so bad at this.

    Would have been so much easier to just come out from the start, acknowledge it, shun it, and move on. Im so dizzy from the spin, my doc might prescribe me meds
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  8. #1508
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    Quote Originally Posted by michealo View Post
    Yes, I have always been critical of move and waggle. Don't play dumb, please.
    You never found me flip-flopping, I've found lots of yours however....

    Who flip-flopped on waggle?
    Keep hiding from this, great plan
    So critical you havent spoken a word on it even though sony been showing it off the past 2 yrs with psvr....
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  9. #1509
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    It doesnt matter when it was said? The fuck you talkin about dude? That matters more than you think!
    No, because THEY BOTH COMPLETELY DISMISSED ALL OF VR BEFORE YOU STARTED WITH THE ACCUSATIONS. Since this includes any and all use of waggle with VR as well, it doesn't matter when mich or Badger humored you by specifically answering they feel waggle still sucks.

    Would have been so much easier to just come out from the start, acknowledge it, shun it, and move on.
    This is just stupid. Anyone who's not a complete moron who's been around these boards for the last few years knows mich and Badger despise motion controls (except mild usage in mich's case). They shunned it a long time ago. Badger especially... he's talked shit about all forms of motion control for so long, and this includes Move based on a quote ____YOU____ pasted here a few pages back, it is amazing that you demand that he does so again.

    Besides, it doesn't matter -- since they SHUNNED ALL OF VR BEFORE ANY OF YOUR ACCUSATIONS, which AUTOMATICALLY includes any waggle included as well. How can they possibly imagine the possibilities of <anything VR-related>, if they want VR to go away and have explicitly said so?

    It's just idiotic, guy.

    Of us 3, the ONLY one who could in any way be shown as imagining the possibilities of VR is me. And the only examples where it seemed like it could work were controller-based games. AND I imagined the possibilities with Natal anyway. So, there's no flip-flop possible there either.

    AND this is not some new diversion: I made this point (as have others, of course) tens and tens of pages back. You just ignored it then.
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  10. #1510
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    So critical you havent spoken a word on it even though sony been showing it off the past 2 yrs with psvr....
    This angle of "if you didn't say x, you meant y" is truly pathetic. Where did I ever say anything positive about PSVR or motion controls? It's all garbage to me and a waste of time.
    Even after you abandoned the accusation that people flip-flopped on waggle with PSVR then denied it until you saw 3 quotes of yours.

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  11. #1511
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedRedSuit View Post
    What? You're making no sense. This obviously means any game where I can still use the gamepad, and it makes sense.

    You said you'd have no leg to stand on if someone were interested only in controller-based VR games and not waggle.

    - I specifically pointed out THAT IS WHAT I AM INTERESTED IN (controller-based VR games; NOT necessarily just cockpit; I "imagined" that FPS might be cool too).
    - I specifically pointed out THAT I WOULD IGNORE MOTION-BASED GAMES FOR VR.

    Both points are quoted very plainly in the post to which you replied. Therefore by your own admission you have no leg to stand on.
    You pointed out you would ignore motion based games only AFTER a few weeks of bullshit and only after called out on it. You dont suddenly claim something after all the craziness, personal attacks, defense and deflections and meant it all along.
    Go to bed son, you are being schooled again

    What is that supposed to mean? Suppose your dream comes true, and PS VR turns out to be 95% about Move-related games. OK... so, JUST LIKE I SAID, I will ignore those games. What does that prove? That I've been consistent, and that your accusation was full of shit? OK.

    I didn't "shun motion" until "much later"? No, I shunned it after nearly all motion games turned out to be Oprah shit, once Kinect and Move came out. I don't have to yell out "waggle sucks!" in every post in order for this view to be clear.

    Besides, given that I imagine the possibilities with Natal anyway, it doesn't matter -- half of your flip-flop accusation is not true.
    Supposed my dream comes true? Ims what you call a bettins man and im makin a bet. My bet has great odds heavily in my favor, being that EVERY show sony had psvr they demoed motion with it.

    No you dont have to shun waggle at every turn. No one is saying that. Its that you (and others) never shunned waggle with vr even once, until i dropped that hammer down and made it that damn obvious.
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  12. #1512
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    Quote Originally Posted by michealo View Post
    This angle of "if you didn't say x, you meant y" is truly pathetic. Where did I ever say anything positive about PSVR or motion controls? It's all garbage to me and a waste of time.
    Even after you abandoned the accusation that people flip-flopped on waggle with PSVR then denied it until you saw 3 quotes of yours.

    Trolling too hard, you cannot avenge kinect
    Not pathetic at all. Its one thing that not a single word was said about motion for 2 yrs psvr was shown off. Its another thing after the hammer drop that resulted in reactions like dismissals, denials, spin, fabricated angles and just overall craziness with more deflections, oh and repeated personal attacks cant forget that one.

    You didnt say anything positive about psvr and motion controls, cuz ya didnt say anything at all!!!
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  13. #1513
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    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    You pointed out you would ignore motion based games only AFTER a few weeks of bullshit and only after called out on it.You dont suddenly claim something after all the craziness, personal attacks, defense and deflections and meant it all along.
    I said I would ignore those games far before any personal attacks. So that's a lie.

    In any case, it doesn't MATTER.

    (1) Yelling out "X sucks" is not necessary, especially when everyone knows you feel that way anyway. As mich keeps pointing out, it is a totally absurd demand. It's like me having to demand that nightie keep reiterating that remasters suck when talking about BC. I already know he thinks that... I'm not going to ding him for not saying it.

    (2) Regardless, in my case, I "imagined the possibilities" with motion (Natal) anyway (and not, like, once or twice -- for an entire year, as proven with quotes), so you cannot construct a flip-flop to imagining the possibilities anyway.

    No you dont have to shun waggle at every turn. No one is saying that. Its that you (and others) never shunned waggle with vr even once,
    - *I* didn't have to do it even once, because I praised Natal and imagined the possibilities with it -- and not once but over the course of a year (proven with quotes).

    - mich and Badger don't have to do it even once, because they've dismissed ALL OF THE VR FEATURE AS A GIMMICK.

    - The whole idea that someone has to keep reminding you they hate X, when their hatred of X has been utterly established over the years, is completely stupid.
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  14. #1514
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    Let's expose some more cuco lies using proof.

    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    You pointed out you would ignore motion based games only AFTER a few weeks of bullshit
    cuco is saying here that he, like, forced the confession that waggle sucks out of me after just OMGWEEKSANDWEEKS!!!! of arguing and insults. Let's see when it happened in reality-land.

    Here is my first post on VR, where I said anything positive about it at all. This basically started all the flip-flop attacking by cuco. Dec 26:

    Quote Originally Posted by RedRedSuit View Post
    I just bought and beat Ace Combat 6 (360 exclusive... I'm such SDF!). If AC7 with VR is like AC6, including that last-gen level of visuals, then I am absolutely in. The game must be mind blowing with cockpit or HUD view with VR. Holy shit.

    Disclaimer: might suck. We will see.
    Now, here is the post where I say that motion controls are a RESOUNDING NO. Dec 30:

    Quote Originally Posted by RedRedSuit View Post
    If you're asking whether motion controls (like Move, Kinect) as a main source of input is cool -- the answer appears to be a resounding NO, as after many years no one has figured out a way to smoothly control motion in a 3D game with it.

    However, AC7 VR, on the face of it, sounds cool to me, since a regular controller remains the main source of input, without it being unnatural. That's why I praised the idea of it (hopefully I'm not wrong about it... but I have been before, such as when I was excited about Natal).
    NOW, how many weeks between Dec 30th and Dec 26? Less than one! Yet, supposedly I explicitly shunned motion controls

    Quote Originally Posted by cuco33 View Post
    AFTER a few weeks of bullshit
    Note that this is also far far far far before any "personal insults." Actually weeks before. This was when were still relatively civil, actually. So that's another lie/misrepresentation by you. It's almost a month ago that I said this! And so did mich and Badger.

    As a bonus, in the same post I even point out I potentially like AC7 VR, because it's with a regular controller! Oh shit, you have no leg to stand on, again!

    ---

    Just in case you again try to call the arguments made above -- that mich and Badger are anti-VR (therefore automatically anti-waggle-VR), and that I imagined the possibilities of Natal, therefore cannot be hypocritical about imagining the possibilities of VR -- some "new angle" or "diversion," here is when I brought this up (possibly not even the first time). Dec 29th, a mere 3 days after I said anything nice about VR at all:

    Quote Originally Posted by RedRedSuit View Post
    1. Badger on a daily basis trashes PS VR.

    2. michealo just today posted that he hopes no one releases a VR or AR solution.

    3. I was publicly and repeatedly excited about Natal. Eventually it was released and turned out to be basically a POS for the Oprah crowd, and I pointed this fact out, but I certainly did not "continuously <trash> kinect and any argument <you> made over it."

    Retry.
    Last edited by RedRedSuit; 01-22-2016 at 12:50 AM.
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  15. #1515
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    Its amazing how rattled you are over psvr and motion
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